Is inequality really that bad? Isn't human history full of examples of inequality?

likefunny
Posting as :
works at
You are currently posting as works at
Highlighted IconHIGHLIGHTED

It’s not that bad. It’s only bad for those who gotta suffered.

~ every privileged humans

likefunny

Right now, no. It’s funny because inequality is actually much lower in the US than you think if you account for all the government transfer payments and programs. However, the clickbait Twitter analysts will conveniently ignore that fact. Sure, super extreme inequality is bad, but that’s not the reality.

likesmart

BA1 - I know the study you are referring to about economic inequality, the point of which was to point out how some measures of inequality leave out government transfers. Problem is that the same study left out all sorts of valuable benefits on the private side too. They criticized the “left” for cherry picking the benefits that count towards income inequality, and then did their own cherry picking.

like
Recent IconRecent

Inequality. Earning an A because you were smarter or studied harder than someone else who got a C. So, I guess everyone should get a C. Now what. Will people try harder to get the same C? Or will everyone reduce their achievement since you all get the same?

What about the farmer who toils at growing corn. If half is taken and given to the neighbor who didn’t bother to plant how does that game end the next year (that happened at Jamestown for a year or 2. - all communal and basically everyone stopped working hard. They gave people their own plots of land to work and keep what they grew and magically people worked harder and grew more.)

Now if the student was precluded from buying books or the farmer not allowed to buy seeds because someone didn’t like them, of course that is bad. But if everyone could study or work, then I don’t think inequality is bad.

Also recent raises. We’re they differentiated based on performance? Well that is unequal? Can you leave to go to another company or get promoted…unequal.

Capitalism raises all boats. Been proven time and again.

likefunnyuplifting

Imagine being this person’s manager. I bet very time they shift some pixels and change out a prospect’s name on an already-made deck, they think that it’s the spirit of John Galt inspiring them to speak genius into existence

like

So human history is the benchmark for what’s OK? Human history is full of examples of slavery, torture, raping and pillaging, etc etc. are those cool too?

likesmartfunny

Yea I took it to an extreme to showcase just how nonsensical it is to use “human history” as a litmus test for what’s OK lmao

likesmart

Human history also filled with rape and murder over thousands of years.

likesmartfunny

Yeah…isn’t human history also full of examples of death destruction and suffering?

likefunny

Well… we’ve been keeping up with traditions.

likefunny

Not all discrepancies in outcomes are bad. If you think every aspect of society should be 1:1 representation...🤡🤡🤡🤡

likefunny

Like many things, inequality is neither good or bad. It just is and in some settings is necessary for progress — same way inequality in the level of charge / energy is necessary for electricity, flowing rivers, etc. It is the origins of inequality and the results of it that can make it undesirable. This distinction is important and I think is lost on many.

There will always be a distribution of (inequality in) talent, capability, resources — not every child born will be a Michael B Jordan. But an evolved society is one that manages the natural distribution of resources such that the “less fortunate” gets an opportunity at a meaningful life (however they choose to define that meaning)

likesmart

BCG1 - a well put perspective

Ooof, lots of naive belief in a just world in here.

There have certainly been times in history when inequality was pretty bad, but the current divide between rich and poor, particularly on a global scale, is about the worst its been. Because the floor hasn't risen - the poorest are still dying of starvation, exposure, dirty water and easily preventable diseases, being trafficked and exploited and kept in indentured servitude. Meanwhile the ceiling has skyrocketed - leisure trips to space, and more hoarded wealth than could reasonably be spent in multiple lifetimes.

Even just within the US - the gap between median lifestyle and the top has widened significantly in the last couple decades, and by a number of different metrics, comparative middle class quality of life and financial stability has declined.

Interestingly, studies show that when inequality rises, mental health and life satisfaction gets worse for *everyone* - not just the disadvantaged, but the wealthy as well.

like

I'm unfortunately completely flattened after a long day or I'd be all over bringing in the detailed references - because yes, there are definitely some interesting counter currents in specific areas. It's important to put it into context though - the vast increase in global productivity and efficiency in distribution of resources enabled by technology. In some of the cases, it's not that inequality has fallen drastically, it's that the total pool of available resources has risen significantly, so there's a greater spread of outcomes possible - ie if you only have $20 to go around, and you split it amongst 4 ppl $9-$5-$4-$2, vs you have $100 split $70-$20-$8-$2*, the standard of living of the middle group has gone up in absolute terms, even though the inequality is signficantly worse.

*asterisk for the obviously more complicated economic math of resources vs population growth vs amenities, etc

like

Unequal (and relatedly, not socially mobile) societies are not that pleasant or stable to live in. The top calcifies in place, only serving itself. Incompetence abounds and eventually the bottom rises up. That can go a couple of ways, violent revolution or just general lawlessness where the rich has to provide their own security.

I think we're on track for the latter; look at Brazil for a glimpse. I wouldn't want to be rich if it had to be in Brazil.

like

Being rich in Brazil is actually good. The society is pretty divided and you can live pretty well, surrounded by other affluent individuals.
It is just hard to keep a clear conscious knowing that 90%+ of the country cannot afford the same lifestyle

like

This post gives off "I got a BMW for my 16th birthday" energy.

like

Is inequality at any level bad? Not necessarily.
Is massive inequality that is a small group capturing the majority and a large group saving less than earning and growing earning less than COL an issue? Absolutely.

Just because there are past examples, doesn’t mean it works.

like

Some level of inequality is ok. People have different levels of ambition.
What is not ok is over half of the population living in extremely poor conditions, being denied access to basic things like water, food, shelter and education.

like

Yes. It’s that bad. Historically it’s been even worse (though in some cases also better)

like

Those that fight to end inequality are usually those who suffer under it.
To argue that inequality "isn't that bad" because it has always existed in some form is pretty daft.

like

OK, here’s an interesting consulting example that illustrates how wealth inequality has changed in the US and impacted not just poor people but all of you.

In 2000 I was a senior manager / principal equivalent at a small consulting firm in Texas. We were hiring fresh undergraduates out of UT Austin at $78K a year. According to the inflation calculator I just used, that’s $123,660 in today’s money. What do the Big 4 pay fresh undergraduate hires in 2021?

As a senior manager / principal my base salary was $185K ($293,296 in today’s money) and I had bonus, profit share, equity, and options on top of that. What do Big 4 senior managers make today?

In real terms, most consultants are making half what they made 20 years ago. How do the incomes of CEOs and top .1% earners today compare to 20 years ago?

There have always been people who make or have more money. What changes is how fair that gap is and how much it reflects the differences in contribution and effort vs. the differences in circumstance of birth.

Sometimes that difference is fair and a good representation of the different contributions made by the individuals. Sometimes it’s unfair and based mostly on circumstance of birth.

America (and consulting firms) have an ideal of being meritocracies. But, really they’re not. We all start from a different points in time, geography, background, and wealth and the returns and rewards we see for our effort and contributions are higher or lower based mostly on those start points rather than what we personally do.

Consultants born 20 years earlier got paid a heck of a lot more for the same or less effort than those who are entering the profession today.

like

Lots of comments here with no common definition of what constitutes inequality. I hope the OP wasn’t asking about inequalities due to ability (physical/mental/emotional) but rather inequalities due to race, ethnicity, age, religion, etc.
One area of inequality that is more difficult to quantify and discern is economic inequality. IMHO the issue is the increasing challenge of wealth distribution - ultra-wealthy keep getting more, lower income workers get less, and the middle class is shrinking. The issue is that it isn’t a level playing field; a few powerful people at the top set the rules for their benefit. Economic inequalities based on ability are natural; inequalities based on a rigged system are not.
Human history is full of inequality - and full of examples of the ramifications of same with revolution, death and destruction coming from those feeling the unjust impact of inequality.
Generally the only people asking questions like this are those who enjoy privilege, those not the target of such inequality.

like

Unequal intellect and inequitable access to education are two different things. One is a fact, the other is a construct of society.

like

There will always be have and have nots - many have tried to change and failed

like

So long as their income/wealth was not acquired through theft, fraud, or corruption, I don’t see why it’s a bad thing that some people have more than others, even if it means massive inequality. How does that harm people?

likesmart

This zero-sum thinking is the problem. No one is taking from anyone by acknowledging that extreme inequality is undesirable or that not everyone starts at the same (or even remotely similar) places. Many of the policy solutions for these also don’t take anything from anyone.

You also probably don’t believe that taking from others is always morally wrong. We take from everyone to fund a common defense, borders, etc. I’m guessing that there’s some level of those you support. Your issue is about the degree of the taking and its purpose, not the act itself. So it’s about taking being morally wrong, it’s that you don’t want people to take your money for this or that you don’t think these are moral reason to take from people.

Related Posts

What is the health insurance coverage at Google? How much deductible and copay?

Deducting S Corp owner health insurance when they aren't really an employee? Owner doesn't do anything for the business anymore, but still wants the health insurance.

"Health and accident insurance premiums paid on behalf of a greater than 2-percent S corporation shareholder-employee are deductible by the S corporation and reportable as wages on the shareholder-employee’s Form W-2, subject to income tax withholding."

like

Aside from all the usual benefits like paid vacation time, health insurance, 401k matching program, have you ever seen a truly unique business perk?

like

Hello, I am a new grad with a doctorate in OT. I just got an offer for a job working at a private school. The offer is 58K with benefits. 15 days PTO. Do you guys think I can negotiate the salary to 70K, which based on my research is the average pay for my level of experience and education? Or is that too much to ask?

like

Looking to exit UTHEALTH SA for other opportunities. Healthcare is great but pay/retirement is womp-womp. How is comp and benefits at your company? Can someone who has been in academic medicine as a Clinical Reporting Analyst transition to other industries? Thoughts fishies.

like

About to close on our first house and wondering if you can pay mortgage using credit cards to get additional point benefits (or a prepaid debit card that is replenished using a credit card). Don’t want to let 30k worth of expenses go without benefits if at all possible. Thanks in advance

like

Are there benefits to working at a small shop versus a large agency?

like

I have an issue: just been informed by compliance I have a violation. Using a brokerage restricted and at this point I am at a loss. I sold off all my stock just to comply. Then put the only stock I kept with the broker, the other one is my wife’s employer 401k savings broker. The instructions say they will reach me within 90 days for next steps. It also says there may be financial penalties.

What should I do? I replied the email immediately asking for help. I am a new to Deloitte and the US

Any insight into GrayRobinson? As a whole and their litigation or healthcare areas specifically.

like

I have 2 offers to consider. What makes more sense?
Full time role with 3 weeks vacation and benefits or contract opportunity with 20k more in potential salary.

Little background, I have been a loyal employee and have only worked at 1 firm for about 6 years now. Looking for more growth and obviously money.

Need some suggestions on what to consider and any pitfalls that I should be aware of.

Thanks

like

When you ask about benefits during the interview process; healthcare, 401k match, etc?

like

I’d like some financial input. I have $56k in a high yield savings account. Other than my checking acct (3-4k) and Roth/401k (which goes untouched) it’s basically all the money I have. (Zero debt/loans, no house/car) Should I be doing something else with part of the money? I know nothing about stocks or investing. Any thoughts?

like

What are some benefits of doing a Masters in a more applied subject like data science compared to a more theory one like purely statistics? Considering a quant heavy masters vs functional (M Ed)

like

Anyone have an SO who is a healthcare worker? The two places where my bf works as an OT is having a Covid outbreak (despite all being vaccinated/boosted) and I can’t decide if I should hold off on hanging out with him. Same exact scenario as last year - last January he contracted Covid in between vaccinations and thankfully I made the decision not to spend time with him during the last outbreak as a precaution. Sucks. Can’t decide what to do. Already dealt w/ 2 quarantines b/c of his kid

like

Any healthcare consultants here?

like

I work at a b4, I got a job offer from amidsize Promotion and going from 120-140. Should I take it? It would be a new start, and they mentioned less hours. The only issue I am thinking about is not having July and December weeks off. Otherwise the benefits are the same.

like

Tips for getting back into the swing of things after paternity leave?

like

How bad is it to leave a job after only several weeks? Another offer came through and benefits are incomparable. I hate to burn bridges.

like

Left KPMG last year to move to smaller consulting firm. I still have my 401k over there and haven’t rolled it over anywhere. What are my best options? Currently maxing out 401k

helpful
like

More Posts

Anyone transitioned from SaaS / PaaS consulting (SalesForce / ServiceNow / etc.) to GCP work? If so, thoughts on the change?

like

EY GDS - 33 fixed
Deloitte India - 36 fixed

Which one to choose ?
YOE - 9.5 yrs
Tech - SAP

like

Not sure what to do with my student federal loans. Weirdly my private loans have a 3% rate while federal loans are at 6.5% makes no sense

like

Hey fish fam! What are you all seeing in terms of interest rates? Was quoted a high rate (excellent credit score, no debt, great salary) need to know what’s out there.

like

Help!!! Hotel points or Flyer Miles? If in matters, I'm a Hilton/Delta guy. I'm trying to get a credit card from Amex to get the point from my corporate card... can't decide between hotel or miles.

like

Does anyone have any recommendations for mentor texts for writing (3rd grade)?

So I’m a senior headed into law school that has two pre law programs lined up for the summer. They’re both midsized southeast firms. How can I best spring board into big law from here?

likehelpful

After you’ve pulled an all-nighter, how do you get through the next day? Caffeine? Exercise? Take a nap? Quit early?

like

Question for everyone here: hybrid - 2 / 3 days a week or remote work? Which do you prefer and why?

likehelpful

Folks from EY, what are the implications of investing in India, be it Mutual Funds or direct stock? I’m worries about the independence restrictions in India, holding off due to that

I’m new to the firm and have A LOT of downtime. I will get a report to do and finish it within the next day or two and then get nothing for DAYS. Is this normal? Will this change? I mean…it’s definitely nice but I want to stay billable and keep my job lol. Any insight?

like

What I really need right now is __________________________.

like

Does anyone work part-time/reduced hours? If so, willing to share compensation numbers? I’m in a position to do so and very happy about that but unsure what to ask for in terms of $$. South FL, family law. Thanks!

like

How many miles are appropriate for a 12 hour delay and one day missed of work as a result? This was international travel, delay wasn’t weather related.

like
like

Thoughts on the new WRX?

like

Hi Fishes,
I need your help for a referral. I have the job id. Can anyone please refer. I am serving notice period.

like

How do you combat imposter syndrome? I know my job in and out, yet I still feel like I am faking my way to it and that I shouldn’t be where I am. It’s affecting my motivation to be better. How do you deal with this battle?

like

Additional Posts in Consulting

Any good mountain bike for starters? Male, Height 6 ft, Weight 200 pounds

like

Best technical skills and learning opportunities for corporate finance?

- VBA, SQL, Python (Coursera/LinkedIn Learning)
- Quant (R)
- Hyperion or other apps (work)
- CFA study (books)

like

Best resources (books, online courses) to learn theoretical part of sales process?

like

Hey Guys, wanted to know whether utilization gets adjusted when you take LOA. TIA

likehelpful

Ok, Friday confession. Who here actually purchased tickets or went to Fyre fest?

funnylike

Are there any books about how commercial operations generally work? Regardless of industry (for the most set) - strategic planning, sales & ops planning, financial planning & analysis? Just like a 101 or 201 on it, could it even be a textbook. I can’t find much. Thank you

like

Best consulting firms for strategy in the US besides the big 4 and MBB?

like

TFW someone you don't know requests to connect on LinkedIn and when you accept, you are bombarded with their bi-minute updates, shares, likes, and comments. #active 😐

like

Does anyone know what brand of pillows Sheraton use?? I want me some of that!

like

Book recommendations. Your favorite -
1. Autobiography/Biography
2. Self Help
3. Financial Literacy
4. Non-Fiction (not from 1,2 or 3)
5. Fiction
Go!

like

Better to be bold and to stand up to a client or just shut up and tell them they're right/take their shit? Senior associate who doesn't care much if fired

like

Which firm has the best dressed consultants?

like

Is it rare for someone from MBB to move to big four?

like

I am a SM hoping to make Principal. One of my development areas where I believe I can do better is Relationship Management and Sales. Any advice on courses, books, etc. to help improve?

likehelpful

Are the six sigma certs actually worth it to do?

like

Thoughts on winking at someone you're interested in? 😉

like

Happy New Year folks! May this year get you the best that consulting can offer. Sending out good thoughts on the first travel day of the year. :)

like

Why are people saying that EY will be stingy with raises this year?

like

Decent food in SLC airport? Had catcora's last Thursday and got sick as a dog 🤢

like

Does anyone have ballpark idea of salary for a Deloitte Boomerang Manager who had strong performance in prior tenure (2s at YE, every year)?

like

New to Fishbowl?

Download the Fishbowl app to
unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.
That was just a preview…
Sign Up to see all discussions
  • Discover what it’s like to work at companies from real professionals
  • Get candid advice from people in your field in a safe space
  • Chat and network with other professionals in your field
Sign up in seconds to unlock all discussions on Fishbowl.

Already a user?
Login here

Share

Embed this post

Copy and paste embed code on your site

Preview

Download the
Fishbowl app

See what’s happening in your industry
from the palm of your hand.

A phone with Fishbowl app

Send download link to your phone

OR

Scan your QR code to download
Fishbowl app on your mobile

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use and Privacy Policy.

Messaging rates may apply

Download app

Sign up for free to view this conversation on Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use and Privacy Policy

Already have an account? Log in

Sign up for free to continue using Fishbowl

By continuing you agree to Terms of Use(New) and Privacy Policy(New)
Messaging rates may apply

Already have an account? Log in

For account settings, visit Fishbowl on Desktop Browser or

General

Legal